11 things we’ve learned on this journey
Last week Between Two Beers ticked over one million podcast downloads. Here's 11 things we have learned through the journey.
Consistency + quality = success
Sixteen months ago, we made the decision to be consistent. One podcast a week, every week, never miss. Sixteen months ago our audience was around 10,000 downloads a month. Last month we did 141,000. These two things are related. Success in the podcast world is a long game. Consistency + quality over time = audience.
Do your research
"How did you know that?", "I’ve never talked about this before", "you guys sure have done your research". Three phrases we love to hear. Guests mirror our effort. If we can show them how important the chat is to us, and how much work we’ve put into it – they pay it back in spades. No shortcuts, do the work.
Everyone has a story to tell
But in the best eps, it’s not the one you think. There are many times when we’ll book a guest, and assume we know how the chat will go. But upon researching – find the story goes much deeper. With Dave Wood we thought the most interesting angle would be what it's like training Israel Adesanya. But that just became a footnote when we discovered the real gold; how his success was built on a foundation of incredible travel stories, real-life experiences as a paramedic and walking toward stressful situations.
NZ is so humble
“I don’t think I’ll have much to say”. We hear it all the time, from incredibly accomplished people. Ninety minutes later the time has flown by. One guest we’ve been desperate to get on for a while. “I’ve seen your other guests and I just don’t think I’ll be interesting,” she said. “There’s not much to talk about.” She’s one of NZ’s most loved athletes with an Olympic gold medal! We’ll keep trying...
Active listening for the win
Ask a good question, get a good answer. Ask a good question, get a good answer, listen to the answer and ask a good follow-up question... that’s where the real gold is. By staying in the conversation and probing away again – it gives the guest permission to breathe into the storytelling. We want more. And there’s no time limit. Tell us...
The beer is a gimmick
Between Two Beers started as a playful name. But over time I’ve realised it's helped us create a ‘different’ space. Seamus doesn’t drink anymore, a lot of the time our guests don’t, and sometimes I might only have one or two beers. But the framing of ‘a chat over a beer’, separates it from traditional media - and traditional interviews. It’s a subconscious way of relaxing the guest.
Community is important
Luke Kemeys from Boys Get Paid is a master of building community. It’s an area we hadn’t given much thought to in 2022. We were just focused on ‘the content’. But a beer with him opened our eyes. We now have a weekly newsletter (hey there 👋) and post once a week on LinkedIn, which is creating a super valuable network. We interact with all messages that come through social media and plan on hosting live events in the future to (hopefully) bring everyone together. We have a great audience, now we want to do something with it.
Good feedback is all we need
It’s amazing how much fuel a good comment on an episode can give us. The thought that strangers take time out of their day to message us saying how much they enjoyed a podcast really makes me smile. Our plans, visions and expectations for where this is heading have changed a lot over the last 12 months, but the feedback still hits exactly the same.
Live Q and A is the future
Seamus and I hosted a 25-minute live Q and A with Lord Ian Botham this year, and bloody loved it. We realised the skills we have developed over 120 episodes easily transfer to the live setting. Seamus and I have done a lot of MCing together (and are available for hire), but the two-pronged live Q and A scene has really got us excited.
Stay true to the brand
Last month we got offered an exclusive chance to speak to one of the world’s biggest sports stars. But it was a bite-sized interview length, well short of the long-form brand we have developed. “We are so keen, but to be true to our audience, we need an hour minimum”, we replied. Will keep you posted.
If you're going to start a podcast
Do it with your best mate. There's a ruthless edge to the way we communicate about episodes with each other, which works because it's based in a friendship of over 20 years. It's not always smooth sailing, but usually one of us is up when the other is down. Sharing this journey, and potentially creating a job, with your best friend makes the success so much sweeter.
